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[levy@sdl.sri.com: problem with data predicates]
by Manuel Hermenegildo 02 May '01

02 May '01

------- Start of forwarded message ------- X-Coding-System: nil Return-Path: <levy(a)sdl.sri.com> Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2001 20:05:45 -0700 From: Joshua Levy <levy(a)sdl.sri.com> Subject: problem with data predicates Hello, I've recently installed ciao v1.6p3 (Linux), and the system seems to be working well. However, I've run into a problem in using the data predicates. Can you tell me if it is a bug, or what I'm doing wrong? I made a file foo.pl containing: :- module(foo,[main/0]). blah(1). main :- assertz_fact(blah(2)), blah(2). Now if I trace the source, it behaves as I would expect -- blah(2) is satified. But if I compile it, it ends with failure. Any insight would be appreciated. (Also, while I'm asking, is there a way to avoid the 'undefined predicate' error that results if I delete the blah(1) assertion?) Thanks very much for you help, and for making an excellent prolog system freely available. Sincerely, Joshua Levy ------- End of forwarded message ------- -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- herme(a)fi.upm.es | Manuel Hermenegildo +34-91-336-7435 (Work) | Facultad de Informatica, UPM +34-91-352-4819 or 336-7412 (FAX) | Universidad Politecnica de Madrid http://www.clip.dia.fi.upm.es/~herme | 28660-Boadilla del Monte, MADRID SPAIN -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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A question about the license
by MBrader＠luminous.com 28 Apr '01

28 Apr '01

Hi, After many years absence (10) I am looking into pursuing logic programming again and have been looking at many alternative languages/environments. CIAO looks very good. Of course, right now I am just studying, so there is no license problem. But I was wondering whether you intend the system to eventually be usable to produce commercial product. That is, executables that include code or special modules you would release say, under the Gnu Public Library License. Most of the companies I have worked for in the valley use the GNU c/c++ compiler as the superior compiler, and the division between that which is absolutely free (and contaminates all it touches) and that part which can be combined into product is clearly what has allowed its success. Your website says that ALL of the software provided is under the General License. That would imply that all the libraries are, and therefore anything built as an executable (which must of course include whatever your variant of WAM is, etc, and libraries) would be 'contaminated' and could not be a commercial product. I have not downloaded yet, so perhaps you have clarified this in internal docs. Please do not misunderstand me. I believe that everyone should be free to choose any form of contract and therefore if you wish to make certain that your system can only be used for non-commercial purposes, then I certainly respect that. I would just like some clarification if this is NOT so. Eventually I will be interested in including executables developed from logic and constraint language systems in commercial product. Thank you Mark J Brader (personal e-mail address: braderm(a)acm.org) Mark J Brader Direct: (408) 342-2547 Luminous Networks Main: (408) 342-6400 10460 Bubb Road Fax: (408) 863-1148 Cupertino, CA 95014 mbrader(a)luminous.com

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Re: A question about the license
by MCL 28 Apr '01

28 Apr '01

Dear Mark, Our current intention is to make Ciao Prolog a product with a license similar in spirit to that of the LGPL. The wording might be slightly different, though. We regard Ciao Prolog as a product basically similar in spirit to any other compiler, and the GNU gcc family you mention is, in our opinion, a very good example. If the webpage, or any internal document which comes with Ciao Prolog, mentions the GPL license, that is our fault---thanks for pointing it out. Of course, any questions regarding the availability of Ciao Prolog for commercial use are welcome. Manuel Carro & the Ciao Prolog Team ______________________________________________________________ Carla didn't think of Jack as a luscious apparatus after that.

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Win32 Install OK, Xemacs Interface Almost OK
by jimserac＠mindspring.com 28 Apr '01

28 Apr '01

Installed ciao-1.7p93Win32.zip and followed instructions. Ciao shell comes up OK. Followed instructions for using ciao Prolog from Emacs (I'm using Xemacs 21.2 Beta (40) which was already installed(this is not the Cygwin specific Xemacs)). Added line (load-file "C:/Program Files/ciao-1.7p93Win32/DOTemacs.el") to my emacs init file. Got errors on the lines global-font-lock-mode and transient-mark-mode so commented them out in DOTemacs.el DOTemacs.el then loaded OK and got proper Ciao Prolog Menus at top of Xemacs after loading a sample prolog app. But...(see below)/ Loaded a prolog (.pl) program into workspace and it started Ciao shell within an Xemacs buffer OK but it's dropping the slashes in the path to the desired prolog application. Here is the error message I got. {ERROR: absolute_file_name/7, arg 1 - file c:Archives2graph.pl not found} It should be C:\Archives2\graph.pl so it's dropping the slashes for some reason. I'm using Cygwin Bash as my shell for Xemacs. Have not checked the rest of DOTemacs.el yet, the problem is probably something in there that works for Emacs but not for Xemacs. Any suggestions welcome. Thanks Jim

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Re: problem with data predicates
by Manuel Carro 27 Apr '01

27 Apr '01

Joshua Levy writes: >> However, I've >> run into a problem in using the data predicates. >> Can you tell me if it is a bug, or what I'm doing wrong? >> I made a file foo.pl containing: >> >> :- module(foo,[main/0]). >> >> blah(1). >> >> main :- >> assertz_fact(blah(2)), >> blah(2). >> You should declare blah/1 as a data predicate by inserting :- data blah/1. after the module declaration (it can go anywhere, but respecting certain order makes programs easier to read for other people). This tells the compiler that blah/1 is dynamic, and can be changed during program execution. These predicates are compiled specially, and the compiler must be aware of that. The main/0 call fails (silently) at the point of doing assertz_fact. Note that assertz_fact/1 is a Ciao Prolog extension for asserting facts. If you use the ISO Prolog assertz/1 (slightly less efficient in the case of facts) a runtime error is raised. Note that it is not necessary that a blah/1 fact appears in the source code: the predicate still exists even if it has no clauses. >> Now if I trace the source, it behaves as I would expect -- >> blah(2) is satified. But if I compile it, it ends >> with failure. Any insight would be appreciated. Programs debugged in the toplevel are also loaded in a special interpreted mode, which happens to be the same as a dynamic predicate. That's why the clause assertion does not fail. However assertz_fact gives an error. assert{a,z}_fact make less tests than the assert{a,z} primitive, which, in part, explains their faster execution. Your program could have been classified as "wrong" (quotes intended) by simple ocular inspection, but other cases, such as main:- ... assertz_fact(G), ... are not so straightforward, and would need a non-trivial amount of analysis. It is our hope to plug other analysis tools we are developing into Ciao Prolog to catch these errors at compile time, without overloading the execution. Note that I quoted "wrong" on purpose: it may be the intention of the program author that the program fails (in Prolog sense) if the fact to be asserted is not among those declared as data/1. >> (Also, while I'm asking, is there a way to avoid the >> 'undefined predicate' error that results if I delete >> the blah(1) assertion?) blah(1) is not an assertion, but a predicate definition --- more exactly, a clause of a predicate definition. If you take it out, the compiler finds a explicit call to blah/1 which cannot be resolved a compile time, since no module exporting it is being loaded. >> Thanks very much for you help, >> and for making an excellent prolog system freely available. Thanks for you kind words! MCL __________________________________________________________________ Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.

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RE: Ciao and Emacs on Win NT 4.0
by Mike_Hewitt＠kcmo.org 05 Apr '01

05 Apr '01

Yesterday I reported a problem with loading the Ciao interpreter in Emacs on Windows NT Workstation 4.0 sp6. Now thanks to Dan Larner at Xerox Parc my ciao/emacs problem is solved. The problem involved changing the path \ to / in DOTemacs.el. Everything works fine. Thanks to you and this list. Mike Hewitt "Larner, Dan <larner(a)parc.xerox.com>" <larner on 04/04/2001 04:03:17 PM To: "'Mike_Hewitt(a)kcmo.org'" <Mike_Hewitt(a)kcmo.org> cc: ciao-users(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: RE: Ciao and Emacs on Win NT 4.0 I had the same problem. In my case it was due to the use of backslashes in the DOTemaces.el file in the Ciao Directory. All instances of say e:\ need to be changed to e:/ For example: "E:\prolog/ciao-1.7p30Win32/shell/ciaosh.bat" should be changed to "E:/prolog/ciao-1.7p30Win32/shell/ciaosh.bat"

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Re: Ciao and Emacs on Win NT 4.0
by Mike_Hewitt＠kcmo.org 04 Apr '01

04 Apr '01

In answer to my post: >> I have been successful at getting Ciao-1.6p3 for win32 to run under Emacs >> 20.4 on Windows 98 but not on Windows NT Workstation version 4.0 sp6. The >> ciao-mode loads fine, the syntax colouring is there, the manuals are there >> etc. BUT whein I try to run the ciao system (i. e. load a buffer of prolog >> code into the ciao interpreter) within Emacs I get the following error >> whcih shows in the Emacs "minibuffer" below the main emacs window: >> "Spawning child process: exec format error". Since I'm not an Emacs >> expert I can't be of much for help to you except to say the it works fine >> on Windows 98 and I've also been successful at getting it to run on Red Hat >> Linux ver. 5.1 I have tried to use Emacs version 20.7 and 19.34 as well as >> 20.4 but have the same problem on all of them using NT 4.0 sp6. This may be >> an Emacs/NT problem and not a Ciao problem. The newer ciao-1.7p83Win32 >> version also has this problem. You asked: > Which version of Emacs are you using? Can you open a Windows shell in > Emacs (just do M-x shell)? If no, it is possible that you are using a > anti-virus software which is causing problems: My answer: I am using emacs ver 20.4 and, yes, I can open a standard NT shell using M-x shell. No, I am not running any anti-virus software. I have cygwin-b20 installed but emacs doesn't know anything about that. As I say, NT sp6 is the only OS I'm using that has this problem. Thanks for the LInux PPC advice (I'm actually running SUSE 7.0 on PowerMac 9500/180mp at home). Thanks, Mike Hewitt

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BOUNCE ciao-users@clip.dia.fi.upm.es: Approval required:
by owner-ciao-users 04 Apr '01

04 Apr '01

>From postmaster Wed Apr 4 21:06:33 2001 Received: from goofy.fi.upm.es by clip.dia.fi.upm.es (8.9.3/FI-4.2) Wed, 4 Apr 2001 21:06:33 +0200 From: Mike_Hewitt(a)kcmo.org Received: from conversion.relay.fi.upm.es by relay.fi.upm.es (PMDF V6.0-24 #46251) id <01K20KULF5LS0006EH(a)relay.fi.upm.es> for ciao-users(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es; Wed, 04 Apr 2001 21:05:31 +0200 (MET-DST) Received: from relay.upm.es (einstein.ccupm.upm.es [138.100.4.8]) by relay.fi.upm.es (PMDF V6.0-24 #46251) with ESMTP id <01K20KUIWOPY0006E9(a)relay.fi.upm.es> for ciao-users(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es; Wed, 04 Apr 2001 21:05:28 +0200 (MET-DST) Received: from notesmail.kcmo.org ([208.7.35.61]) by relay.upm.es (8.11.2/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f34J5Pf25197 for <ciao-users(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es>; Wed, 04 Apr 2001 21:05:26 +0200 (MEST) Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2001 14:04:04 -0500 Subject: Ciao and Emacs on Win NT 4.0 To: ciao-users Message-id: <OF59E64B13.C11A2BC1-ON86256A24.00681D3E(a)kcmo.org> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.2a November 23, 1999 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on NotesMail/kcmo(Release 5.0.6a |January 17, 2001) at 04/04/2001 02:03:21 PM Please excuse me if this question has already been asked a million times but I'm new to this list. I have been successful at getting Ciao-1.6p3 for win32 to run under Emacs 20.4 on Windows 98 but not on Windows NT Workstation version 4.0 sp6. The ciao-mode loads fine, the syntax colouring is there, the manuals are there etc. BUT whein I try to run the ciao system (i. e. load a buffer of prolog code into the ciao interpreter) within Emacs I get the following error whcih shows in the Emacs "minibuffer" below the main emacs window: "Spawning child process: exec format error". Since I'm not an Emacs expert I can't be of much for help to you except to say the it works fine on Windows 98 and I've also been successful at getting it to run on Red Hat Linux ver. 5.1 I have tried to use Emacs version 20.7 and 19.34 as well as 20.4 but have the same problem on all of them using NT 4.0 sp6. This may be an Emacs/NT problem and not a Ciao problem. The newer ciao-1.7p83Win32 version also has this problem. Except for this problem the system works very well on both a Gateway Pentium Pro (200 Mhz) with 128 Mb of memory running LInux and a Pentium III at 550 Mhz with 256 Mb of memory running Win 98 and Linux. Has anyone compiled Ciao on Linux PPC on a Macintosh? I may try this. If anyone has any thoughts on the NT problem please let me know. Thank You, Mike Hewitt

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Remote Calling
by Jason Davis 04 Apr '01

04 Apr '01

Hi, Does anyone know how to use the ciao ' foreign_interface '. I wish to drive the prolog with C++ but having looked at the documentation do not know where to start. Can anyone help or supply an example, both for what to put in C and Prolog. I would be very greatful, Jason Davis.

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Ciao Prolog on FreeBSD and other issues
by Manuel Carro 04 Apr '01

04 Apr '01

Dear Ciao users, I am forwarding here some recently exchanged messages regarding compilation of Ciao Prolog on FreeBSD platforms using Linux compatibility and some other topics which may be of interest for some of you. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com Subject: Ciao/Pillow on FreeBSD? To: ciao-users Hi All, I didn't see any discussion of FreeBSD on this list so I assumed it hadn't been tried yet. I have Ciao 1.6 and PiLLoW running on my FreeBSD 4.2 system, compiled under Linux compatibility mode. There were a few small issues but mostly it was straightfoward - in case this might be helpful to someone. Paul Broome First Data Corporation Hunt Valley, MD USA --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Manuel Carro <boris(a)lml.ls.fi.upm.es> Thanks for trying out Ciao Prolog and PiLLoW. Yes, there was no attempt to port Ciao Prolog to Free BSD, mainly because we do not have any Free BSD box available. We would be most grateful if you could send us the changes you had to do in order to compile Ciao Prolog, in order to add them to the current distribution --- with proper ackowledgment, of course! MCL & the Ciao Prolog Team, --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com To: boris(a)aaron.ls.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:13:43 -0500 Dear Manuel, It may be possible to do this more simply. I changed three things: 1) Set USE_THREADS=no in SETTINGS. I actually didn't try threads but I didn't need them. 2) In doc/reference/Makefile, set ECHO=echo. This is because FreeBSD gmake doesn't like the %b in ECHO=printf "%b\n" I was unable to find out what the %b does under gmake. 3) Take out the library -ldl as that's already part of FreeBSD's Linux compatibility. I did this by copying mkf-LINUXi86 into mkf-BSDi86 in makefile-sysdep and setting LIBS= -lm $(LD_THREAD_LIB) $(LD_LOCK_LIB) $(DEBUG_LIBS) and then adding a line to etc/ciao_get_arch that adds another case at around line 55, e.g. *BSD,i[3456]86 ) CIAOARCH=BSDi86 ;; For PiLLoW I was not able to find a lpshell so I wrote a small script that seems to work ok. Hope this is useful to someone. Regards, Paul --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com To: boris(a)aaron.ls.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:13:43 -0500 For PiLLoW I was not able to find a lpshell so I wrote a small script that seems to work ok. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Manuel Hermenegildo <herme(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es> Subject: Re: Ciao on Free BSD All Ciao instalations build an executable called 'ciao-shell' which supersedes lpshell (interpreting Prolog scripts). See the chapter "The script interpreter" in the manual. That was a bug. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Manuel Hermenegildo <herme(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es> To: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com CC: boris(a)aaron.ls.fi.upm.es, ciao(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:17:09 +0200 Paul, actually, the distribution should build an executable called 'ciao-shell' which performs this task (interpreting Prolog scripts). See the chapter "The script interpreter" in the manual. Manuel --------------------------------------------------------------------------- To: Paul Broome/MD/FDMS/FDC(a)FDC cc: herme(a)fi.upm.es, boris(a)aaron.ls.fi.upm.es, ciao(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD > On a related matter, are you aware of any https work with PiLLow/Ciao? That > is, can I login into a secure site under program control, using SSL and > PiLLoW? Not for our part (the Ciao team), sorry. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com To: Daniel Cabeza Gras <bardo(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es> Cc: herme(a)fi.upm.es, boris(a)aaron.ls.fi.upm.es, ciao(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 08:57:50 -0500 Daniel, Thanks. If I discover anything useful, I'll share it. By the way, Ciao on BSD means Ciao might go onto Apple's Mac OS X. I haven't tried though because I don't have a Mac. Paul --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Manuel Carro <boris(a)lml.ls.fi.upm.es> To: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com Cc: ciao(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:14:13 +0200 >> Thanks. If I discover anything useful, I'll share it. >> >> By the way, Ciao on BSD means Ciao might go onto Apple's Mac OS >> X. I haven't tried though because I don't have a Mac. It has already gone onto it. The latest stable version we have in the web does not compile in Mac OS X, but our current development version (also in the web) does. We are finishing some bits, such as the Java interface. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 16:39:12 -0500 Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD To: herme(a)fi.upm.es Manuel, Is your "Efficient Implementation of General Negation" (constructive negation) available somewhere? I have only Chan's first round version in my implementation of relation complement but that's not sufficient and you've taken this quite a bit further. Paul --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Manuel Hermenegildo <herme(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es> To: paul.broome(a)firstdata.com CC: ciao(a)clip.dia.fi.upm.es Subject: Re: Ciao Prolog on Free BSD Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2001 16:11:27 +0200 > Is your "Efficient Implementation of General Negation" > (constructive negation) We have a preliminary prototype working in our develpment version. Susana (and also Daniel) are working on this. I am sending your message to the ciao list so that they can answer too with the details. Man --------------------------------------------------------------------------- MCL ____________________________________________________________ Don't create a problem for which you do not have the answer.

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